The Impact of the Pandemic on Women’s Advancement During Recovery

July 29, 2020

The Empire Club of Canada Presents

The Impact of the Pandemic on Women's Advancement During Recovery

Chairman: Antoinette Tummillo, President, Board of Directors, Empire Club of Canada

Moderator
Vivene Salmon, President, Canadian Bar Association, Vice-President, Country Compliance Manager, Global Banking, Markets Compliance, Bank of America Merrill Lynch

Distinguished Guest Speakers
Christian Petit-Frère, Ontario Lawyer, Empire Club of Canada Voices of Tomorrow
Andrea Carter, CEO, Wealthy Women Warrior, Building Better Organizations
Candies Kotchapaw, founder, Executive Director, Developing Young Leaders of Tomorrow Today
Elizabeth Naumovski , Vice-President Marketing, Caldwell Securities Limited, Financial Literacy Advocate
Dr. Samantha Wells, Senior Director, Senior Scientist, Institute for Mental Health Policy Research, CAMH, Associate Professor, Clinical Public Health Division, Dalla Lana School of Public Health, University of Toronto, Adjunct Associate Professor, Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics, Western University, Adjunct Professor, School of Psychology, Deakin University
Grace Pedota, Marketing & Events Coordinator, CSE, Canadian Stock Exchange

Introduction
It is a great honour for me to be here at the Empire Club of Canada today, which is arguably the most famous and historically relevant speaker’s podium to have ever existed in Canada. It has offered its podium to such international luminaries as Winston Churchill, Ronald Reagan, Audrey Hepburn, the Dalai Lama, Indira Gandhi, and closer to home, from Pierre Trudeau to Justin Trudeau; literally generations of our great nation's leaders, alongside with those of the world's top international diplomats, heads of state, and business and thought leaders.

It is a real honour and distinct privilege to be invited to speak to the Empire Club of Canada, which has been welcoming international diplomats, leaders in business, and in science, and in politics. When they stand at that podium, they speak not only to the entire country, but they can speak to the entire world.

Welcome Address by Antoinette Tummillo, President, Board of Directors, Empire Club of Canada
Good afternoon, fellow directors, past presidents, members, and guests. Welcome to the 117th season of the Empire Club of Canada. My name is Antoinette Tummillo. I'm president of the Empire Club of Canada, and your host for today's virtual event: "The Impact of the Pandemic on Women's Advancement During Recovery: Overcoming Setbacks and Promoting Change for the Better," featuring Andrea Carter, Candies Kopechaw, Elizabeth Naumovski, Dr. Samantha Wells, and moderated by Vivene Salmon. I now call this meeting to order.

Before we begin today, I have a few logistical items to let you know of. If you're finding your internet feed is slow, please see below and click the "Switch Streams" button. There's also a "Request for Help" button available to you if you are experiencing technical difficulties.

I want to take a moment to thank our sponsors who make these events possible. Thank you to our Event Sponsor today, Canadian Securities Exchange TV. I also want to thank our Season Sponsors, Canadian Bankers Association and Waste Connections Canada. And last but not least, thank you to our Event Partner, VVC Productions and LiveMeeting.ca, for webcasting today's event.

Now, before we get into today's panel discussion, we at the Empire Club are, like everyone else, experimenting with various new approaches to optimize your experience of our newly minted virtual platform. We thought we would start today, our session, by introducing a new feature we are calling "Voices of Tomorrow," where we will, from time to time, pass over our podium for a couple of minutes to someone just starting out in his or her professional life and let them tell us how they see this brave new world of ours.

Today, we are delighted to introduce to you a young man who came to Canada only a few years ago from Haiti, and who just a few weeks ago had been called to the Bar in Ontario. He has a remarkable story to tell, and we can assure you that he is set to make a very positive contribution to both his profession and his new country ladies and gentlemen please meet Christian Petit-Frère.

Christian Petit-Frère, Ontario Lawyer, Empire Club of Canada Voices of Tomorrow
Thank you, Madam President, and thank you to the team at the Empire Club of Canada, and the panellists, for giving me this opportunity to address the club. As we continue to talk about the impact of the pandemic on our lives, both personal and collective, and find ways to overcome the challenges that we face, allow me to share my personal story with you. It's a story of hope in the face of adversity.

I was living in my home country in the Caribbean when the earthquake hit, killing more than 300,000 people. Among the dead were my mom, my dad, and my older sister. In just a few seconds, my life had been turned upside down. I was devastated. With no real time to grieve, I quickly had to start thinking like an adult at the age of 18, not only for myself, but also for my three younger siblings. I was in a country that did not have much to offer to young people in the best of times, let alone after a major catastrophe like the one I experienced.

Luckily, I have an uncle with a heart of gold who lives here in Canada. He decided to sponsor my three siblings and me. We arrived in Canada one year after the earthquake. Coming from a totally different world, the move to Canada had its challenges, but I was determined to make the move a success. I was happy to be in a new environment. I was eager to start a new life with a clean slate. I was excited to be in a country where the possibilities are immense, a country where I knew if I worked hard, I could achieve my dreams. I was very fortunate to cross paths with some great Canadians; they served as my mentors. Those individuals' guidance allowed me to dream big, and they showed me that there were opportunities, nothing is impossible.

I chose education. I quickly learned English. I went to university, I then attended law school. I recently became a lawyer, as you just heard. I'm sure the pandemic will impact my career in different ways. But I'm optimistic. I know there will be new possibilities. I think the message you should take from my story is to be positive, and to embrace change. Our resourceful mindset will carry us in these challenging times, just as it carried me in my most difficult times. Thank you, have a great day.

Antoinette Tummillo
What a heartwarming and amazing story, Christian. I'm overwhelmed. I have to tell you, it's the second time I've heard your story, unbelievable story. And thank you for sharing it with all of us. We're really looking forward to following you as you begin your new career, which we know will be filled with success and accomplishments.

And now for today's topic. Earlier this summer, we brought together five ladies to talk about COVID and Canadian Women: Mental Health, Money, and Societal Shifts. If you missed their presentation, you'll want to go back and watch it on our website, as people literally raved about how excellent it was. I must say, on a personal level, that I've rarely, in my career, seen five very different women so perfectly gel to create what people started to call a Super Panel. Judging by the number of questions that the hundreds of people who tuned in were asking, we knew that we had opened up some interesting new areas in our national discussions around the pandemic. And we quickly determined that we needed to bring this elite group back together again, as we all face the daunting possibility of a large new wave of the pandemic, with the accompanying lockdown.

We have all become very aware of how women have borne the brunt of COVID-19 in their workplace and at home. The situation is even more difficult for racialized women, who often must face a whole host of extremely difficult realities which aggravate the impact of the virus on every aspect of their lives. And it has also become very clear to policymakers that these issues do not stay neatly within the female demographic, but in fact have an enormous spiraling effect on all of the men and children who rely on these women in the workplace and at home.

These are enormous economic and social outcomes that must be dealt with holistically and by all of society, or we will face very serious consequences long after this pandemic has left us, assuming of course that it does not become a permanent new reality we must cope with going forward. Whatever course this terrible virus takes, it is now obvious to all that women and the multitude of roles they play in our society must be a central component in the discussions we have and the policy we create in building the new world.

And now let me briefly introduce you once again to our super panel. Andrea Carter, CEO of Wealthy Women Warrior, and Building Better Organizations; neuroscience-based diversity and inclusion learning and development consultant. She brings over 18 years of research and practical application to her training in public speaking and proven methods that support leaders and their teams. Candies Kotchapaw, founder and Executive Director of Developing Young Leaders of Today of Tomorrow Today, received the Top 25 Women of Influence in Canada award by Women of Influence Global, Top 100 Accomplished Black Canadian Women by co-authors Honorable Dr. Jean Augustine, Dr. Denise O'Neil Greene, and Donna Jones-Simmons, and Top 21 Founders to Watch Future of Good in 2020. Elizabeth Naumovski, Vice-President Marketing, Caldwell Securities Limited, is a financial literacy advocate and a champion for women's issues. She's the creator and host of "Finances: Personal Wealth Professional," 2020 Award Finalist for the Mackenzie Investments Award for Female Trailblazer of the Year, and the inaugural recipient of the 2019 Wealth Professional IFSC Institute Award of the Financial Literacy Championship. Dr. Samantha Wells, Senior Director and Senior Scientist, Institute for Mental Health Policy Research at CAMH, and an Associate Professor in Clinical Public Health Division at the Dalla Lana School of Public Health, University of Toronto. She holds positions of Adjunct Associate Professor in the Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics at Western University and Adjunct Associate Professor in the School of Psychology at Deakin University in Australia.

This panel will be moderated by Vivene Salmon, Past President of the Canadian Bar Association. She's the first visible minority and first female corporate council in the over 100-year history of the organization to hold the position. She's Vice-President, Country Compliance Manager, Global Market Global Banking and Markets Compliance at Bank of America Merrill Lynch. She's a Certified Information Privacy Professional, and holds the designation of CIPP/C from the International Association of Privacy Professionals.

Now, I just wanted to remind everyone on this call that this is an interactive event, and we encourage you to take advantage of the question box to the right of your screen and let us know what is on your mind, and if you have any questions for the panellists. Vivene, over to you.

Vivene Salmon, President, Canadian Bar Association, Vice-President, Country Compliance Manager, Global Banking, Markets Compliance, Bank of America Merrill Lynch
Thank you, Antoinette. It's a pleasure to moderate this morning. So, we're going to begin, I think, speaking with Andrea Carter. And when we're thinking about these issues, they're impacting social justice, and there's a lot of impact of the pandemic on women's advancement. Andrea, Corporate Canada is being asked to revisit how they're approaching equity, diversity, inclusion. Canadian stakeholders expect moral behaviour by the leaders. But are we seeing this when we think about these issues?

Andrea Carter, CEO, Wealthy Women Warrior, Building Better Organizations
Yeah, so what a great question to start with. First, it's really important to say that the pandemic has significantly changed the way corporate Canada and stakeholders are looking at EDI, so equity, diversity, and inclusion, as well as corporate social responsibility. And, you know, as a master's candidate in industrial-organizational psychology with a specialty in data and social justice, what I'm, the work that I'm consulting with now is very different than the work that I was doing even a year ago, based on what corporations are asking for. And so, what we're seeing, truly, as we're moving forward—and it was so, you know, perfect that Christian started us off with such optimism and, you know, a reframing of remaining positive and embracing change. Because today, it's not as simple as running a women's initiative, or running an equity, diversity, and inclusion program. And it's also not as simple to just hire more women or get more women back in the workforce. Because the pandemic truly has stirred up many complexities and social justice in a way that truly is here to stay.

And as the US elections near and polarization amps up, we're going to need to look more and more at these solutions and the concepts that are often outside the typical business case realm that organizational structure has used in the past. So, when leadership teams come to the table and they understand that right now a the time for us to start implementing different strategies, the numbers are really fascinating. They're uplifting me. I , I am so excited about what I'm seeing in the organizations that I'm working with. Because, by fixing women's unemployment and supporting corporate culture, this ends up adding $13 trillion to our global GDP by 2030.

The organizations that are already doing the work are seeing that there's a windfall of positives. And, you know, as I mentioned, I am excited about how fast stakeholders are responding and are motivated by these changes. But the flip side of not taking action, and adopting the belief that, well, you know, social justice has been raised in the past, and it's just a phase, what that's going to do is it's going to lower our global GDP growth by, to just one trillion in 2030, than what it would be, if women's unemployment simply tracked the men in each sector.

So, we really need to think about how we're looking at equity, diversity, and inclusion, as well as how it intersects with corporate social justice. And we're really evolving into an intersection of moving from corporate social responsibility into more of that corporate social justice element. And this is because Canadian stakeholders are being forced to reconsider what justice actually is and how women and diversity fit into it.

Now, what's really interesting, is that we don't have to be as high level complex that it prevents us from taking action. And to that point, today, I really want to highlight the solutions. Because the companies that I have been working with understand that what they are doing before the pandemic, that is no longer applicable. But the data supports that, and they're moving towards really great elements that are working within corporate strategy.

So, I should mention that there is a handout in the references section from today, and there is, you can download it, called "Five Solutions to Transform Corporate Social Responsibility Into Action Stakeholders Believe and Respond Positively To." So, make sure to download that, because it has way more information than what I can cover today. But there are top, there are three top areas that, when leaders implement and adopt these elements and model them—so that's the synchronization between saying and doing—the, the result has been that there is a credible substantial stakeholder buy-in. And what we're seeing is a less amount of turnover, we're seeing more engagement, and we're seeing women that are otherwise unable to stay in their role stay in their role. So, that that's exciting.

And the three top elements are: creating psychological safety, repairing trust, and fostering a culture of belonging. So, when we have those three elements, the reason those are working is because it has to do with the perception of justice acting as a proxy for trust. And most leaders start with the bias that, hey, what I've been doing is really good work. And while you may have been doing really good work, the problem is that society has changed in the past nine months. And when you're looking at what you need to do, in order to equalize and invite in BIPOC women, what we're seeing is that the old models truly do miss the mark.

And the positives really start happening when leaders declare amnesty for the past, and move into pairing strategy decisions with human behaviour. And I'm really excited to continue to divulge into that. I'm being told that I need to wrap up, so I'm going to wrap up and let this go back to Vivene. But I know that we have lots of really great content that all of us are going to talk about towards this element, as well.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Andrea. So, we're going to maybe weave in what you're talking about a little bit more with diversity and inclusion and think about, specifically, People of Colour. So, Candies, I'm going to turn this question over to you: what do you think are some of the economic impacts on People of Colour during this pandemic?

Candies Kotchapaw, Founder, Executive Director, Developing Young Leaders of Tomorrow Today
Thank you, Viviane, for that, and thank you, Andrea, for setting this up so well, this transition. So, I'll give a bit of a sense, I'll take back, a little bit, before we even talk about, you know, some of the major challenges. So, first of all, to overcome, step back, and promote change for the better, we have to head back to the place where BIPOC people are already located. We are already at the intersection of socio-economic exclusions and structural barriers to self-actualization. We are already at the place of a disjuncture between navigating our economic realities and the cost of living within our society. And we have been at the place where the systems we engage with on a daily basis do not see People of Colour as valuable enough to invest in. These are our realities pre-COVID.

So, how do we dismantle, or how do we begin to dismantle these areas to get to planning for a just and fair recovery? For me, in this context, and I've lived as a Person of Colour for 36 years now, this is my story. This is, you know, this is lived experience for me. So, in this context, I see that there are three major setbacks that exist in pre-COVID-19 but are now amplified by COVID-19. So, the first is socio-economic reality. Inequities in access to stable and healthy finances have been a perpetual reality for BIPOC people. And these structural inequities are of course based in the ideology of the type of work that merits a stable income. So one that, one that allows the earner to be able to not just get by but also to thrive.

The second challenge is that governments and financial institutions and general societal belief systems around the worthiness of BIPOC people, where finances are concerned. So, that statement in itself indicates to me that the responsibility that society places on individuals who are People of Colour is unrealistic, generally. Because the opportunities that exist don't enable BIPOC people to be able to compete at the same level. And this is, of course, prior to COVID. General knowledge within the BIPOC community of existing support systems and channels that are available to access needed support. This is of course a challenge because within BIPOC communities, we are expected to be able to manage, we are expected to be able to compete on the same scale that everyone else is, even though our starting line is so far behind everyone else.

So, these three setbacks are translating to devastation for women's advancement. And what ends up happening is that we're seeing increasing rates of evictions pre-government interventions, dependence on predatory lending for families to cope, and we're seeing also increases in insolvencies. So, I'm just being noted that I have to wrap up as well. So, what I'm hoping to achieve today is to talk about some of the structural changes that are occurring ,specifically around institutional support. So, what governments have been doing, particularly the federal government, but what more things that need to be done at the provincial level, particularly in Ontario, and also community-based supports that exist that people can have access to, to help overcome these setbacks. Over to you, Vivene.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Candies. So, we're going to take that theme of economic impacts a little bit further and expand it out. And I know that during this time, there's been an increase in fraud, and scammers, and fake websites, and a lot of things that are negative impact to our broader community. Elizabeth, you're an expert in this area. I'm going to ask you what red flags should we be looking for and how can we protect ourselves?

Elizabeth Naumovski, Vice-President Marketing, Caldwell Securities Ltd, Financial Literacy Advocate
So, thank you so much. Because we've been at home self-isolating, because the new normal is very different, people are working from home, we have all become huge targets for fraud. And scammers are on a high alert trying to entice us with a text, with a phone call, with an email. There's two really important things that I want to say right now. If you get an email, a text, or a phone call: stop, pause, think, delete, or hang up. And the other thing is, as children, we were always taught not to talk to strangers. So, nowadays, in 2020, let's not talk to strangers. If someone sends you an email or someone contacts you, you don't know who they are, they want to ask you for a favour, they want to share an inheritance with you, whatever, do not talk to strangers. Delete, and move on.

Romance scams, right now, are huge. Of course, we're at home, we're self-isolating, we're vulnerable, we're lonely, and who doesn't want to be loved? We all want to have somebody to love. However, there are criminals out there that are posing as a doctor that is working internationally, they're posing as someone in the military, they are posing as someone working on an oil rig. But they're always posing as somebody working afar. Somebody working in another country, a third-world country or whatever. So, red flags. What do you have to look for? If this romance just moves on very, very quickly, slow down and take a look at it. Because once it moves quickly, they're going to start asking you for money, they're going to want you to wire money, they're going to want Google cards, Amazon cards, or whatever it is. Stop, pause, think. Because you have enough time to have a relationship evolve, just like a friendship. So, nothing will go very, very quickly. Red, red, red flags.

The other thing to look for is phone scams. How many of you have received a CRA scam? The RCMP is coming to arrest you. The RCMP is not going to arrest you. The thing is, in Canada, we are full of immigrants. And immigrants either know the rules or they don't know the rules. And so, what happens is you get scared. Of course, you're going to be afraid if somebody says that they're coming to arrest you. So, once again, hang up. And if you are unsure, go to the CRA website, call them, and talk to them. Nothing is urgent. Anything that, if anybody tells you something is extremely urgent and you have to make a decision right away, that's a huge red flag. So, don't do it.

You know, we've all been consuming—not we, everyone who's been self-isolating, I'm not going to say we—people have been at home drinking a little bit more or consuming cannabis, if you are going to purchase your cannabis, make sure that it is a proper retail outlet, because there are so many websites out there that are scams. They are made up too good to be true. The pricing is good, it's going to be fraud.

And the other thing, too, is a lot of major corporations are having their logos stolen, and fraudsters are creating these crazy websites. Especially, let's say if it's somebody in the investment industry. They will promise you 15% daily return, they will promise you returns that are unheard of. But the bottom line is, if it's too good to be true, it really is. Step back, protect yourself, as I said, stop, pause, think, take a moment, go online and search for the proper website, contact somebody that, you know, contact somebody that, talk to a friend. There are too many people that are being scammed right now. And the bottom line is, there is no shame in being a victim of fraud. Come out and tell someone, talk, report the incident, talk to the police, talk to a friend. The Anti-Fraud Centre has an incredible website, antifraudcentre.ca; their phone number 1-888-495-8501. Do not be silent. The other thing is fraudsters will come and try to defraud you a second and third time. So, be aware, stop, pause, think, and don't talk to strangers.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you very much, Elizabeth. So, we're going to switch gears a little bit. And during this pandemic, mental health, I think, has been on everyone's mind, and I think it's impacted everyone in some way. Maybe now we'll ask Dr. Samantha Wells, who has done a lot of research at CAMH. And your research has shown elevated levels of anxiety, depression, and loneliness for women during this pandemic. Can you give us an update on where your research is sitting now?

Dr. Samantha Wells, Senior Director, Senior Scientist, Institute for Mental Health Policy Research, CAMH, Associate Professor, Clinical Public Health Division, Dalla Lana School of Public Health, University of Toronto, Adjunct Associate Professor, Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics, Western University, Adjunct Professor, School of Psychology, Deakin University
Sure. Thank you so much, Vivene, and thank you for all of the other panellists so far. It's exciting to hear you all, with your interesting perspectives. Yes, in terms of the research, so in collaboration with a leading global research technology company, Delvinia, CAMH has been running, since the spring, a national survey series focused on better understanding Canadians' mental health and substance use during the pandemic. And back in May, women were more likely than men to experience anxiety, depressive symptoms, and loneliness. And through the summer, we saw, generally, that men and women were gradually on par regarding these indicators of mental health. However, based on preliminary analyses of new data that's just come in from our most recent survey, it looks again like over the last couple of weeks, that women are just disproportionately affected by the pandemic. But I can't give you all the results at this moment. But please check out the CAMH website, the mental health dashboard, with the new data to be posted very soon.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Samantha. And so, when we're thinking about this as well, when we think about mental health, we need to think, I think, specifically about women's mental health. What is CAMH doing, specifically to address women's mental health now? And are there, is there research under the way that we should know about, that people could be aware of in the future?

Dr. Samantha Wells
Yes, well, we know that even before the pandemic, women faced significant disparities in mental health. And we also know there are large gaps in knowledge regarding women's mental health. And we saw we need to get a better understanding of the underlying mechanisms and risk factors for mental illness for women, as well as ways to improve treatment outcomes for women. So, CAMH has already has a number of initiatives underway looking at women's mental health, such as improving outcomes for new mothers with postpartum depression, improving diagnosis and treatment for girls and women with Autism. But to further advance efforts in understanding women's mental health, CAMH launched Womenmind, which is a new the philanthropic community committed to closing the gender gap in women's mental health. And this was spurred by support from the Treliving family, who are founding members of Womenmind. So, in its first years, Womenmind will support new innovative research focusing on women's mental health through seed grant competitions, fellowships to research trainees, junior scientist positions, as well as hosting an annual global research symposium on women's mental health. And the second goal of Womenmind is to address the gender gap in the sciences, and as many, many of, you know, women are underrepresented in most scientific disciplines. And while forty percent of scientists at CAMH are women, more can be done to close the gender gap in the sciences. And of course, we all know the pandemic has had a negative impact on women, and women in research in particular. So, we know, for example, through a number of studies that recently came out that women researchers are publishing less since the pandemic hit. So, basically, Womenmind will be launching a number of initiatives to advance women in the sciences at CAMH, including recruiting new scientists, new women scientists, providing early career startup support for women, and offering mentoring for women in science.

So, I'm very passionate about this initiative, both for personal and professional reasons. I've seen personally how mental illness can impact women's lives, and the lives of those around them. My own mother suffered from mental illness and addiction. And she never received the help she needed, and eventually, she succumbed to her disease. So, from a personal perspective, I know that more needs to be done to address women's mental health. But I'm also a woman studying—I have a background in mathematics, epidemiology, and I was very fortunate to receive support and mentorship throughout my career. But I see that women in the sciences more need more support to get where they need to go. So, overall, through the work of Womenmind, I'm excited to see CAMH tackling two major issues for women: the gender gap in mental health, and the gender gap in the sciences. So, these are two issues that require attention at all times, but especially, during and after the pandemic.

QUESTION & ANSWER

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Dr. Wells. So, we have a couple questions starting up in the queue, and I'm going to perhaps direct this question to Andrea, in regards to establishing a corporate social responsibility strategy. What is working so that stakeholders buy into the changes and changes are experienced as genuine steps towards change?

Andrea Carter
Yes, that's another really great question. I think the big element is that it doesn't matter what industry you're in, so whether it's mining or finance, law, pharma, tech, we know that social justice and inclusion are top of mind. And so, we're looking at how to advance in the face of more uncertainty. And when we're establishing models that are employee-centred, we're able to actualize elements that are otherwise, you know, they're left to the wayside and they're unaddressed. And so, what offers real support for stakeholders is looking at the element of psychological safety, belonging, and trust. And when we open these elements, we actually reduce the complexities that typically prevent us from having really great conversations and real conversations.

I think the thing that I see the most within the organizations that I'm involved with is the questioning of, okay, so we're doing this now, but is it actually going to take effect? Are these questionnaires going to show up within social responsible elements? And truly, what I find is that when psychological safety and belonging are present, things like mental health, being able to address how our time differences are different between the male and the female contributions, as well as what BIPOC people are experiencing for how they're contributing to the workplace.

So, from a neuroscience perspective, really the best way to increase your engagement while we're still in this pandemic and attend to the women's advancement element is to shift gears, and to look at the perceptions of justice. And that means we need to start looking at how to help stakeholders reduce automatic emotional reactions such as anger, shame, guilt, and judgment. And those are showing up because of the isolation, those are showing up because of many of the complexities. But the path to rebuilding—and heading back into what Christian started with, and you know, I think what so many have talked about as well, Sam and Candies as well, you know, when we're looking at positive and embracing change, the path to rebuilding for the pandemic and women's advancement and corporate social responsibility, truly is reversing back into the human element of our frontline workers, and being able to support them where they are at. That's where we're seeing such huge progress, and just wonderful positivity of being able to support workers that are otherwise struggling with mental health or struggling with the ability to even show up to work. And I think when we come together, and when we action elements of belonging, it changes how we perceive what's being said because words carry weight, and they shift how we think, and how we respond to what's in front of us.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you very much, Andrea. You mentioned People of Colour again, there, and there's a question coming in, which I'm going to turn over to Candies—and maybe, Candies, you can weave these questions in together, in terms of what types of supports currently exist that People of Colour can access, and are there any specific systemic blockages that you think need to be dismantled, in order to assist people. And following that, what kind of supports need to be specifically targeted for People of Colour?

Candies Kotchapaw
Thanks, Vivene, for that. So, maybe I'll start with the supports, first, that currently exist or are emerging as support. So, I'll start with my own backyard, which is within Toronto. And here in Toronto, a lot of the supports that we see being available to people come from community organizations, as well as municipally. So, I'll speak, specifically, about the EPIC program. The EPIC program is Eviction Prevention and Intervention. And that's available to anyone who is, you know, who has had difficulties paying their rent, have had significant challenges with rental arrears, and are, you know, about to be evicted from their housing. The City of Toronto program will be there to support you. There's also the Rent Bank that you can ask to get some financial support in order to pay your landlord. And currently, also, the province has instituted a stay on, a moratorium on evictions that was briefly lifted, and now there's lobbying to reinstate that. So, we're watching that very keenly.

The other thing that I want to speak about is alternatives to payday loans. So, one of the challenges that research is indicating—that we knew before—is that payday lenders are like, are loan sharks. They go after the most vulnerable in communities, and that often, typically, are People of Colour, BIPOC. And so, you know, they're charging exorbitant fees, such as up to 780% of return on a loan. So, in the time of COVID, we know that CERB just recently ended, and now people are waiting for that transition. What are the alternatives? Well, first and foremost, people should consider the stigma that's around people who depend on credit, right? It's a reality that exists within BIPOC communities because the alternative for accessing financing through financial institutions is very, very low. So, that's something that we need to look at. And ACORN Canada is lobbying for, first and foremost, more regulations, provincial regulations on payday lenders, as well as access, financial institutions stepping up to the plate and looking at the value of supporting BIPOC communities by offering affordable lending solutions. And then also, we want to let people know that there are opportunities and maybe , you know, greater options for looking at alternative credit solutions, including credit counseling, insolvencies, and bankruptcies. And these are realities, you know. We have to remove the stigma around these things. Because the reality of where people is, the option is to survive, or to, you know, not survive in this reality.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Candies. I think, maybe, we'll go back to a question in the queue that is asking about the economics and finances, again—and maybe I'll turn this one back over to Elizabeth. But my understanding is that Canadians have been saving at the highest rates ever, really, in more than 60 years. Canadians seem to be, versus other countries, being a country of savers. But what would you tell Canadians about the future, though, in terms of, perhaps, preparing for things that might be unexpected that come up, maybe living a life of needs versus wants, and how people can prioritize that and how they overall can manage their finances, especially in a time of economic stress, where their jobs might not be as stable?

Elizabeth Naumovski
So, you are correct. We have started to save at the best level in 60 years, now, in Canada. However, we are very divided in Canada; you have people that have a lot of money, and people that are really struggling a lot. So, the key is, in order for you to protect yourself for another pandemic, another shutdown, or another happening. We all need to have emergency funds. We need to have that money stashed away for an emergency. When CERB ends, you've lost your job, you're struggling on a huge basis right now. I think what people really need to look at is how much money are they making, versus how much money are they spending. Because prior to this pandemic, people were spending like crazy, and the debt level was really high. So, I've been saying, you know, let's make frugality fashionable, let's look at a life of what we need, versus what we want. The problem is people get caught up in purchasing something to make themselves feel better. So, impulse shopping. "I want to go and buy this because I'm feeling down, I'm feeling depressed." But that's a short-term high for long-term debt.

So, think about how long you have to work in order to purchase something. If the thing is going to cost you twenty dollars and you make twenty dollars an hour, well then, you know you have to work one hour. But what about if it costs a hundred dollars or a thousand dollars? And are you going to pay it outright? Or do you have to put it on credit? Because we all know that you should pay your credit card off every single month, because the interest is compounded, and it'll take you years upon years to pay it off if you only pay the minimum.

I was looking at one of my credit card statements last year. I was paying off my wedding. And I looked at it, and they said it was a ten-dollar minimum per month. It was about eleven thousand dollars. But it would take me 109 years to pay off. So, think about minimum payments. Think about saving money. I'm not saying stop doing something completely. If you like wine, buy your wine. But maybe buy a cheaper wine or don't drink as much, and whatever money you're saving on it, put it aside.

Last November, I started the Five Dollars-A-Day Savings Program. So, people are spending five dollars-a-day on whatever their favorite drink is, or whatever their favorite sandwich is, or whatever. Take that money, put it in a drawer. Whenever you tell somebody to save a hundred dollars-a-month, psychologically, they think a hundred dollars is way too much, "I need that money." But if you start putting away five dollars-a-day, by the end of the month, it's 150 dollars, and it accumulates throughout the year. So, think about savings for yourself, for the next pandemic, for the next shutdown, for your future.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Elizabeth. So, we have a question coming in from the queue, which I'm going to turn over to Dr. Wells. This person is asking about the Sandwich Generation, people that are overwhelmed, sometimes, by caring for elderly parents and children. What supports are needed to help women, specifically mothers, who are now part of the Sandwich Generation group, as they balance caring for children, and struggle with taking care of the home and their own professional lives, without compromising their career goals? Over to you, Samantha.

Dr. Samantha Wells
Thank you. What an excellent question. And I certainly know many women in that very position where they're—you know, and women are always the ones who multitask. They take on so many different roles. They're running around looking after children, they're cleaning the house, they're looking after elderly parents, they're doing everything. And I have to say, you know, I'm guilty of doing some of that myself. And, and, and I shouldn't say guilty, because it's the wrong word to use, because I think it's a fabulous quality that women have. But women do have to look after themselves. You can't help others without also making sure you're looking after yourself first. So, my only advice, with the very short amount of time that we have left in this discussion, is, is—my only piece of advice here is for women to make sure that your own mental health is being looked after. Take time for yourself, take time to rest. Because if you collapse, then everyone else who depends on you will also, you know, have their own challenges. And it is possible to find supports. It is possible to find other women who you can talk to and reflect on how to manage all of these pieces. But do, do what's right for yourself. And of course, always know that if you're in a time of great need or crisis, there are supports out there in the community. So, do seek them out if you need them.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Dr. Wells. There's another question which I'm going to direct over to Andrea. And this person is asking: are there specific tools that the corporate world can be doing to help women, especially during the pandemic, have a more level playing field compared to men? I don't know, over to you, Andrea.

Andrea Carter
Thank you, another great question. I think that there are. So again, I always come back to the element of belonging. And, you know, as a mixture of what, you know, Dr. Samantha Wells has said, and, and all of our panellists, really, what I always say to start with is, is do a survey. Survey your people first, and look at the numbers, so that you understand how many women you're looking at in each sector of, whether that's frontline or whether that's executive level. Because at each of those levels, you're going to see that women have different demands and different needs. And if you don't know where they are on the chart of feeling like they belong—which in all honesty, belonging for women in the workforce is still very, very weakly received—and for all of these topics that we've just been sharing. So, you need to be looking at polling your people about these five specific elements. So, comfort: I feel comfortable at work; I'm treated fairly and respected by my colleagues; you know, I'm encouraged to share my unique perspective; I'm encouraged to share the struggles that I'm experiencing.

So, you know, from comfort to contribution, to connection, to psychological trust, to well-being, those are all elements that need to be sought out. And what we'll find is that, when you first start, your baseline is going to be low. Don't hide that. Celebrate the fact that you now have a baseline, and then look for the ways that you're going to support people moving forward. That is the best way to start repairing that psychological trust, and your ability to connect with where people are and what they're struggling with. Yeah. Thank you.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Andrea. So, I think we have time for a quick response to maybe two more questions. This person is asking you, Elizabeth, if there are any specific books that are directed at young women in terms of how they can manage their finances, and are there anything specific that young women should think about, in terms of how they handle their finances early on?

Elizabeth Naumovski
Well, we've, as young women, we've always been told to go to a good school, get really, really good grades, and find a great job. But then we don't know what to do with the money that we've made when we land that great job. What you could do is go to "Finances Personnel" and watch the TV shows that I have put together, geared towards young women and women of all ages. Kelly Keen, a good friend of mine, has come up with a good book. I can't remember it right now. "Talk Money to Me," it's called. "Talk Money to Me." But I think the thing is, we all have to think about curbing our spending and saving for our future. We all know that, as women, we make less money than men do. We make 87 cents to the dollar that a man makes. Our work life has always been disruptive, as Samantha was saying. We are the natural caregivers, so we're in and out of our careers—whether we're taking care of children, or our parents, or something else. So, we really do need to be mindful of how much money we spend, and how much money we save. So, I think that's the key. Just make sure that you don't go impulse shopping, and don't just spend your money because you feel like spending it. Hang on to every penny that you make.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you, Elizabeth. I think we have time for one other quick question, and this person is asking about supports for women of Colour—or not just women of Colour, but marginalized populations in general ,who have been on the front lines during this pandemic—are there anything, specifically, Candies, you might have mentioned before, as well, in terms of support for People of Colour that are in frontline working positions?

Candies Kotchapaw
Oh, that's a great question. Thank you. So, I'll talk specifically about, first and foremost, that the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives has put out an alternate federal budget. And as we know that the federal government is currently debating further support to get Canadians out of this crunch, this squeeze that we're all feeling. And the focus of the alternative budget coming from the CCPA is that the focus on economic and social equity, right? For BIPOC people.

For me, specifically, one of the things that I do at a DYLOTT is that we focus on young people, right? And we know that young people across Canada so far have felt the brunt of the pandemic, in terms of exposure to the virus itself, as well as being frontline workers themselves, having to be designated as essential workers, but not receiving essential pay. So, that's one area.

I think to support people, BIPOC people, we need to focus on precarious work, and the compensation for precarious work. So again, that debate around what is a minimum wage versus what is a living wage is going to be key. And as well, we want to also focus on education, training, and mentorship, to support people who are going to be transitioning from that precarious work into more secure work. Thank you.

Vivene Salmon
Thank you very much, Candies. So, we're at the top of the hour, and this has been a really informative discussion, once again. I almost think we also, perhaps, need a third panel; we've just had so many questions come in directed at what Corporate Canada can do, at finances during this crisis, at specific mental health supports for People of Colour, at the future of mental health. Again, there's just such a pent-up need for this discussion. But that's all the time we have for today, so I'm going to turn it back to Antoinette Tummillo from the Empire Club.

Antoinette Tummillo
Thanks, Vivene. I would now like to introduce Grace Pedota from the Canadian Securities Exchange, to provide the appreciation remarks.

Note of Appreciation by Grace Pedota, Marketing & Events Coordinator, CSE, Canadian Stock Exchange
Thank you, Antoinette. It has truly been a privilege to be here today, virtually. On behalf of the Empire Club of Canada, our audience, and of course, CSETV on YouTube, the Canadian Securities Exchange forum for conversations with business leaders and entrepreneurs, I want to express a sincere thank you to our panellists, our wonderful moderator, and our super panel guests. Your comments today were so relevant at a time when we can collectively start considering how we can emerge from this crisis, and what the best way forward will be for all Canadians.

To me, the dialogue truly brought to life what we have learned since the inaugural milestone event that happened this past summer, which brought together the same five remarkable leaders who spoke candidly about issues impacting women in the workplace, at home, and across all aspects of society, to how we are going to emerge from this crisis, and what the best way forward will be for all Canadians. More importantly, I am motivated by your insights, and steps that we can collectively take to rebuild and overcome the setbacks women have faced due to the pandemic, and how we can become stronger together as a society, including changes that are needed for a better tomorrow from both a social and economic perspective, and what men and women can do to promote change for the better. Thank you, again, for this powerful conversation, and thank you to the audience for your active engagement. Because of the numerous questions that were of such fundamental importance this past summer, it was immediately obvious a second session would be of great importance. And it was. It has been such a pleasure to spend time with you all, virtually, today. And if you like today's content, there's more great content on CSETV, which is the Canadian Securities Exchange YouTube channel, including my "Grace's Picks" playlist, that features recent conversations with female business leaders. Now, back to you, Antoinette.

Concluding Remarks by Antoinette Tummillo
Thank you, Grace. All well put. Thank you, ladies. Another great session, another great discussion. We're all going to be watching what you do, because you are making a difference. So ,keep doing it. We're all behind you. We're all gonna do our thing to help, as Grace says. So, thanks again. And yeah, maybe a third session? I don't know, guys, it seems like there's a lot of interest in what you have to say.

So, just want to tell you about our upcoming session. We've got a session tomorrow on another interesting topic on "Canada's Tourism Industry Impact and Recovery Outlook For 2020 and Beyond." It's at 12 noon. We're also working on a lot of really interesting events coming up, so make sure you check our website; we'll be announcing them soon. And look forward to virtually meeting you all again. Thank you for joining us today, the audience. I really appreciate you calling in. We have a lot of people who did phone in today, or Zoom in—our new reality—so, look forward to Zoom meeting you all again very soon. So, this meeting is now adjourned. Thank you.